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Valve lifters lubrication

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Old Jun 5, 2018 | 02:59 PM
  #11  
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Originally Posted by Lesmyer
I only had 65K miles! Mine had the LIM gasket replaced, but apparently the damage to the engine bearings from coolant in the oil was already done. My camshaft and lifters were not so bad, but still one was collapsing from low oil pressure.

Time for engine to come out unless you're going to put 10w40 in it and try to sell. Pull #1 rod cap and main cap and check bearings - I bet these would be the worst as they are furthest from the oil pump and would starve for pressure if others are getting loose. You may want to evaluate scoring in lifter bores before spending any money on that block.

Unfortunately none of this is a good outcome for a new owner. Crank kit + camshaft and roller lifters are pretty big expense in an engine with old rings and valves. If you want to keep vehicle you might want to check into another engine or even a rebuilt. Not sure how much it takes to import but Jegs has complete GM Goodwrench engines for about $2000USD. I have no way of knowing what would be best for your situation, given your location.
That was a very 1st thing i did next day in the morning. Drained all the oil into a pan and top up a can of fresh 10W40, but engine is over. I suspect seller filled in something way thicker than 10W40 to hide the worn off bearings and waited till a cold October Besides I am a bad liar
Found Your movie in a nearby topic. Indeed, that is a sound of a collapsed valve lifter. I had approx. 2mm clearance in between a rocker arms and a push rods.

As You can see on the above picture, my engine is nearly ready for extraction. First I will deliver the block to a local workshop for evaluation. If the block would be OK, I am going to place the order for:
- cam shaft
- valve lifters
- push rods
- bearings for camshaft, crankshaft, connecting rods
- a set of gaskets
An estimated cost of the above is around $900 (P.S. which manufacturers I should aim or avoid?) My supplier is getting parts on a monthly basis. Nearest delivery is scheduled around mid of June - my AC condenser and a radiator - so we agreed he will give me a notice prior shipping a next order. Engine rebuilding seems cheaper and after all gives a restful sleep.

A Goodwrench for $2k is a nice option, especially that You may have a V8 in this price and they come with a 3-years or 100k miles of warranty. But yet the shipping charges and excise doubles the price (at least). And I could spoil the job in never ending story of an engine swap

Getting a used engine here hardly makes sense. They come with no / 30 days of warranty. You cannot determine the viscosity of what's in there, neither the condition. Not, that it is hard to do, but sellers most likely won't allow You to do so. It could be a same time bomb that I just have exploded and it's ain't for free Costs more than a rebuild.

Thanks for the tips
Cheers, Mike
 
Old Jun 6, 2018 | 12:52 AM
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I found an engine offer for a reasonable money: "Cannot be started now, but it was OK, no knocks, nor smoke. Filled with 10W40". Please save me the polish jokes
 
Old Jun 6, 2018 | 04:02 AM
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LOL, all too true.

On the cheap you always get cheap and from own experience you seldom luck out on these offers.
 
Old Jun 6, 2018 | 10:07 AM
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I see (because your oil pressure sending unit is still installed) that you have not yet removed the bell housing bolts. These can be pretty difficult, especially the one behind the accelerator pedal. One tip for getting the fuel line clamp and ground straps off the back of the heads...... remove bell housing bolts and move the engine forward on hoist until oil pan hits the front axle assembly. Then you should have enough room to work behind the heads.

You will need a new plastic timing cover if you change the camshaft. You might want to consider a new timing chain set and to add the additional chain tensioner from the factory service bulletin. Manley makes a relatively inexpensive timing chain set and the tensioner.

Don't forget to have a crank sensor relearn done when you are all finished and are certain things are good. It will run OK, but expect that SES light may be on with P030x code.

If the block is hot tanked, you will need to replace or at least deal with the balance shaft bearings (similar to cam bearings). Not sure if you are planning on a re-ring job or even taking the heads off. If you disturb existing cam bearings then block should be completely disassembled, hot tanked, and oil passages thoroughly cleaned since replacing cam bearings may dislodge old hardened junk collected in the oil passages. Old cam bearings may be OK - sometimes they look pretty horrible but are still just fine. If any rod or main bearings have been actually rattled, the bore where that bearing fits really must be checked for correct dimensions. Unless you are planning on full rebuild, you may want to minimize manipulation of the block and just spin a new crank kit in with the heads still on, change the cam/lifters/timing set, and call it good. To me the biggest issue is if the lifter bores are still OK. Looked like fair amount of scoring on that lifter. If any lifter bores are honed, then the block needs hot-tanking and meticulous cleaning.

Not too many manufacturers making stock roller camshafts for these engines. I bought Sealed Power camshaft and Sealed Power roller lifters. I reused push rods but Sealed Power should have some of those. I like Clevite tri-metal bearings for mains and rods. For cam bearings and balance shaft bearings/bushings you will have to take what you can find or try to re-use. Kind of rare pieces it seems.
 

Last edited by LesMyer; Jun 6, 2018 at 10:44 AM.
Old Jun 6, 2018 | 10:56 AM
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Thanks Les for such a detailed info, especially on the products and advices on the engine removal. You read my mind I've been wondering how to detach the engine from a transfer case.
I don't owe hoist myself, but already scheduled with a friend who's got a hydraulic lift for a Wednesday job. Sadly, I have to dismantle the front too, as it can't raise the engine above.
Then, the next day I am going to land the engine to a workshop that rebuilds stuff asking them to take the measurements. A measuring tools are just too expensive to have. Besides, they seem to be well known here and have a good reputation. So I am gonna rely on them. What they say to replace - I will. As soon as I get the list, I am gonna get back to the dealer asking for possible brand options.
I got another doubt - I've went several times through the service manual for Vortec, and they don't mention anything on the bolts (for connecting rods, etc.) replacing. As far as I know, in vast cases these are one-time use only and should be disposed & replaced. Could You enlighten me in that matter too?
Thanks in advice,
Mike
 
Old Jun 7, 2018 | 07:23 AM
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Hi Mike, the only one-time-use bolts I am aware of are the head bolts (which are Torque to Yield TTY bolts). Not necessary to replace rod bolts on a stock type engine. I can say that if rod bolts are replaced, the big end of the rods are ALWAYS supposed to be resized as different rod bolts can change the fit of the rod cap. If you are assembling engine, you should obtain an angle gauge since major bolts are tightened first with a torque wrench to a low torque, and then a specific number of degrees to final position. Probably you could use old torque specs for rods and mains and just torque with a wrench to final, but TTY head bolts need to be done differently if you have the heads off. Good luck and best wishes for a successful repair.
 

Last edited by LesMyer; Jun 7, 2018 at 07:30 AM.
Old Jun 7, 2018 | 10:52 AM
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O.M.G.
I have been looking an info how to remove the top 2 bolts from bell house. That, what I found made my day:
https://blazerforum.com/forum/engine...g-bolts-17303/
everything from use 3 foot extensoins to drill holes and cover them up with carpet
...
you will need to remove the transmission mount and lower the back of the transmission
...

I went for a flat spanner with ratchet. It took me 10-15 minutes and $8 for the spanner Posting a photo, maybe it's gonna help someone in future.
 
Old Jun 7, 2018 | 01:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Mike.308
O.M.G.
I have been looking an info how to remove the top 2 bolts from bell house. That, what I found made my day:
https://blazerforum.com/forum/engine...g-bolts-17303/

I went for a flat spanner with ratchet. It took me 10-15 minutes and $8 for the spanner Posting a photo, maybe it's gonna help someone in future.
Good!! The driver's side top bolt is usually fairly difficult! But now go for the next one down (behind the accelerator pedal). On mine the body was too close to get to it and/or get the bolt out even if loosened. I pulled the carpet up and zipped a little 2" x 2" flap in the cab floor behind the accelerator pedal with my Dremel cut off wheel - then bent it up to get at the bolt. You can drill through the floor with a very small drill bit (multiple times if necessary) to locate exactly where the bolt is, and where the flap needs to be cut. When finished I bent the flap back into place and sealed over it with duct tape. I was able to leave transmission and transfer case and crossmember and front axle and the body mounts in place (which is really a big time saver).

If your engine has never been out there is a bracket across the two most difficult bolts that holds a wiring harness. This bracket spans both that next bolt I speak of and one of the top two bolts that you just removed. This second bolt is the middle bellhousing bolt going into the engine block on the driver's side. The rest of the bellhousing bolts will not be a problem. You will need to remove the torque converter bolts through the hole where the starter fits and there are a bunch of bolts underneath through the trans bellhousing into the engine oil pan.

Remember to support the transmission up against the transmission tunnel with a floor jack while you clear the ears on the motor mounts - then come forward an inch or two with the engine with the oil pan up against the front axle assembly. Now you can remove the ground straps and fuel line clamp from the rear of the heads (fuel line clamp is very low position on back of the driver's head, so you will need to remove the wiring harness bracket completely and move the harness out of the way for access to it). Finally adjust the floor jack for the max clearance on transmission and flex plate should pop out in front of it (barely) - then you can come straight up with the engine. Hopefully your hoist will go high enough to clear the oil pan. Be careful to not crush the underneath of the evaporator core plastic with the exhaust manifold. If you take the steering column loose from the box, then you have enough room to twist the engine out from underneath the evaporator core as you go up. Later on I figured out to pull and reinstall engine with the right side exhaust manifold removed (out the front) once alternator stuff is removed. That way the starter goes in very easy along side of the engine, there is no interference with the evaporator core case, and the motor mount bolt is very easy to get to from the fenderwell.

Don't forget to disconnect the transmission lines from the oil pan before starting to remove the engine. Lots of people forget these and they get bent up pretty badly and then don't fit well into the radiator.

Here's a diagram that might help with location of the two bolts and bracket on drivers side I am speaking about, a well as locations of grounds on both heads. Fuel lines are shown but not the bracket, the bolt for which is located at the bottom hole on the back of the head behind the wiring harness and the other bracket. My Blazer has not found a need for either the wiring harness bracket or fuel line bracket in 30K miles - but you can put them back on yours if you like!

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/blazerf...897f3b776d.gif
 

Last edited by LesMyer; Jun 7, 2018 at 02:44 PM.
Old Jun 7, 2018 | 02:59 PM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by Lesmyer
Good!! The driver's side top bolt is usually fairly difficult! But now go for the next one down (behind the accelerator pedal). On mine the body was too close to get to it and/or get the bolt out even if loosened. I pulled the carpet up and zipped a little 2" x 2" flap in the cab floor behind the accelerator pedal with my Dremel cut off wheel - then bent it up to get at the bolt. You can drill through the floor with a very small drill bit (multiple times if necessary) to locate exactly where the bolt is, and where the flap needs to be cut. When finished I bent the flap back into place and sealed over it with duct tape. I was able to leave transmission and transfer case and crossmember and front axle and the body mounts in place (which is really a big time saver).
Hm... A premature joy...? You sowed the seed of uncertainty in my mind. I went back to a garage to see if there is any bolt left. But It's hard to see anything there, so I've counted the bolts. I have 8 of them out - 7 on the floor and the last one is out, but fallen down the transfer case. I'll recover it once the engine is out. I've found a drawing on autozone.com indicating there are 8 bolts in total so all seem to be out

I'll keep You updated as the story continues I am so grateful for Your assistance

The other things I have already done:
- exhaust above the starter. That one was easy to extract. The other one is more difficult due to a steering column that interferes getting out a spark plug. I don't like the idea of decoupling the steering column from a steering gear, so I made the exhaust completely loose and I am going to take it out while raising the engine block
- starter
- a shield plate + torque converter bolts

Thanks for the diagram. Seems there are pretty much things attached to a back side of the engine. I'll put extra attention not to break anything
 

Last edited by Mike.308; Jun 7, 2018 at 03:16 PM.
Old Jun 8, 2018 | 04:25 AM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by Lesmyer
Not too many manufacturers making stock roller camshafts for these engines. I bought Sealed Power camshaft and Sealed Power roller lifters. I reused push rods but Sealed Power should have some of those. I like Clevite tri-metal bearings for mains and rods. For cam bearings and balance shaft bearings/bushings you will have to take what you can find or try to re-use. Kind of rare pieces it seems.
I made a call to our dealer, and they get the parts for rebuild from Engine Tech. Can anyone share the experience on their products?
 



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