Researching a 4.3 swap
#1
02-19-2010, 03:51 PM
Researching a 4.3 swap
So, I'm looking at putting a CPI 4.3 and 4L60E in my Toyota 4Runner. I think it will be a perfect combination of power, reliability, and cost for what I'm looking for. Problem is, I know very little about them beyond what I've been able to find online. But when I look for the answers to a few of the questions I have, the search is either too specific, and turns up nothing. or it's too generic and I get too much. I'm not afraid of any project on my subarus or toyota. But a total n00b to chevys.
So, I come here.
First off, a coworker has a '93 S-10 blazer that has about 150k miles on it, but he hit a deer, and then put the doors on his S-10 pickup. but it's a perfect engine donor. and he would be willing to sell it to me for cheap. But, he doesn't know the details of it (he's sure it's a 4-speed Auto but not a 700R4 or 4L60). Is there a plate in the engine bay that would tell exactly what engine/transmission are in it?
Also, he blew up the 700R4 in said pickup. and is going to put a 350/350 combo in it, so he'd be willing to sell me the motor that's in it for a good price as well. this one is lower mileage, and doesn't leak....just in better shape in general. So I would like to use as much of that engine as possible, but convert it to CPI. Would this be possible? maybe swap the intake manifold? I plan on replacing the famous fuel lines and going to the updated pressure regulator, so I'll have that stuff apart anyway.
Lastly, I want to use the stock ECU/TCU. I'm not afraid of wiring, I do wiring for subaru engine swaps on the side ( www.numbchuxconversions.com ). Where's the best place to find reliable wiring diagrams? would a Haynes or Chiltons manual be worth the money? or should I hold out for a factory service manual.
So, I come here.
First off, a coworker has a '93 S-10 blazer that has about 150k miles on it, but he hit a deer, and then put the doors on his S-10 pickup. but it's a perfect engine donor. and he would be willing to sell it to me for cheap. But, he doesn't know the details of it (he's sure it's a 4-speed Auto but not a 700R4 or 4L60). Is there a plate in the engine bay that would tell exactly what engine/transmission are in it?
Also, he blew up the 700R4 in said pickup. and is going to put a 350/350 combo in it, so he'd be willing to sell me the motor that's in it for a good price as well. this one is lower mileage, and doesn't leak....just in better shape in general. So I would like to use as much of that engine as possible, but convert it to CPI. Would this be possible? maybe swap the intake manifold? I plan on replacing the famous fuel lines and going to the updated pressure regulator, so I'll have that stuff apart anyway.
Lastly, I want to use the stock ECU/TCU. I'm not afraid of wiring, I do wiring for subaru engine swaps on the side ( www.numbchuxconversions.com ). Where's the best place to find reliable wiring diagrams? would a Haynes or Chiltons manual be worth the money? or should I hold out for a factory service manual.
#2
02-19-2010, 04:31 PM
TBI and CPI were available as early as '92 so a CPI conversion should not be tough 
i believe there is a kit mentioned around here some where.... it consists of a new injector spider, FPR, bracket, and gaskets for after you tear the top off your engine...
Check the vin number of his blazer. the (i want to say) 6th character should be a "Z" is that is the case you have a late 1st gen s-series blazer and the engine should be a rather yawn producing TBI 162 hp/235 lb·ft torque
if it has the "Vortec" branded plenum cover, it is the CPFI 190-200hp/260 lb·ft torque engine you hear such good things about and are the workhorses we of the newer blazer line have come to love (debatable hps...)
and they only get better from there....
in general, the wiring diagrams are more of a schematic nature and sorely lacking in the manuals... if you search for wiring diagrams around the site I believe swartlkk has posted just about every break down of every part ever imagined on every blazer (and spin off) ever.....
if you get the ball rolling on this project , pictures will be WARMLY recieved. A 'yota with a Blazer heart is a scary/sexy thing
Welcome to the forum. i'm sure there will be a bit of help rolling your way
i believe there is a kit mentioned around here some where.... it consists of a new injector spider, FPR, bracket, and gaskets for after you tear the top off your engine...Check the vin number of his blazer. the (i want to say) 6th character should be a "Z" is that is the case you have a late 1st gen s-series blazer and the engine should be a rather yawn producing TBI 162 hp/235 lb·ft torque
if it has the "Vortec" branded plenum cover, it is the CPFI 190-200hp/260 lb·ft torque engine you hear such good things about and are the workhorses we of the newer blazer line have come to love (debatable hps...)
and they only get better from there....
in general, the wiring diagrams are more of a schematic nature and sorely lacking in the manuals... if you search for wiring diagrams around the site I believe swartlkk has posted just about every break down of every part ever imagined on every blazer (and spin off) ever.....
if you get the ball rolling on this project , pictures will be WARMLY recieved. A 'yota with a Blazer heart is a scary/sexy thing
Welcome to the forum. i'm sure there will be a bit of help rolling your way
Last edited by ABN31B; 02-19-2010 at 04:34 PM.
#3
02-19-2010, 04:33 PM
first thing you do, take the last 8 digits of the VIN to any GM dealer, and they'll tell ya what trans is in there. you also didn't mention what year the other truck is.
you didn't specifically say on truck was a "Z" code engine (TBI), but since you're asking about swaping over the CPI ("W" code engine) style set-up i take that there is one of each style @ your dispsoal.
did you know that the CPI engine is more money for replacement parts (ie, sensors and such)? basic items (like tune-up stuff) are the same, but just another factor to consider. also, i beleive the W code has an internal balance shaft (in the intake vally), but i'm pretty sure i've pulled apart a Z code with one in it before (not 100% on that though).
you'll need to swap the heads as well if you're still set on swaping over the CPI set-up. and you'll need to get the wiring harness from the truck with the CPI set-up, since the ECM plugs are different (black/black is Z code, blue/red is W code), plus the engine wiring itself is different.
you sound like you've got a good build going on in your head, just be sure to get everything & then some from the trucks, before getting in too deep. hate to find out you sent that one item to the scrap yard, just when you need it.
as for wiring diagrams, stay away from Haynes-i've had 6 1st gen trucks, and those manuals are only good for a reference (if you already know the systems). i've never dealt with the Chilton's books for these trucks, but as always, a factory service manual is always best. you can find them around on eBay, even some publishers have them (i believe Bentley Publishers have them).
GL, be sure to keep us updated, and of course, start your own build thread when you start.
***edit*** damn it Curtis, what do you do, speed type!?!?!
you didn't specifically say on truck was a "Z" code engine (TBI), but since you're asking about swaping over the CPI ("W" code engine) style set-up i take that there is one of each style @ your dispsoal.
did you know that the CPI engine is more money for replacement parts (ie, sensors and such)? basic items (like tune-up stuff) are the same, but just another factor to consider. also, i beleive the W code has an internal balance shaft (in the intake vally), but i'm pretty sure i've pulled apart a Z code with one in it before (not 100% on that though).
you'll need to swap the heads as well if you're still set on swaping over the CPI set-up. and you'll need to get the wiring harness from the truck with the CPI set-up, since the ECM plugs are different (black/black is Z code, blue/red is W code), plus the engine wiring itself is different.
you sound like you've got a good build going on in your head, just be sure to get everything & then some from the trucks, before getting in too deep. hate to find out you sent that one item to the scrap yard, just when you need it.
as for wiring diagrams, stay away from Haynes-i've had 6 1st gen trucks, and those manuals are only good for a reference (if you already know the systems). i've never dealt with the Chilton's books for these trucks, but as always, a factory service manual is always best. you can find them around on eBay, even some publishers have them (i believe Bentley Publishers have them).
GL, be sure to keep us updated, and of course, start your own build thread when you start.
***edit*** damn it Curtis, what do you do, speed type!?!?!
#5
02-19-2010, 11:07 PM
Sorry, I suck at these newbie posts. To clarify. The truck is the same body style, I would assume '90ish, give or take a few years. So, as far as I've read, it has to be TBI. He says the blazer is not TBI, so I'm assuming it's CPI. But he's definitely no mechanic, so I'm not 100% sure.
I would have the blazer as a whole, so I would use the ECU, wiring, sensors, etc. from it. But I would also like to use the block that's in better shape. so assuming the blazer is CPI, that would mean converting. I was hoping that didn't mean swapping heads.....suck.
I've heard the "W" engine code mentioned. But I wasn't sure if that came from the VIN. So that's a help. I'll get that from him and head to a dealer and see what's what.
The diagrams in the Chilton's subaru manual I have are direct copies of the FSM. which is why I ask....maybe I'll just grab a FSM when the time comes though.
And yea, I'll keep you updated on the project. it's not uncommon, there are even options for motor mount adapters and such. But it's hard to get info on GM motors on Yota boards.....
I would have the blazer as a whole, so I would use the ECU, wiring, sensors, etc. from it. But I would also like to use the block that's in better shape. so assuming the blazer is CPI, that would mean converting. I was hoping that didn't mean swapping heads.....suck.
I've heard the "W" engine code mentioned. But I wasn't sure if that came from the VIN. So that's a help. I'll get that from him and head to a dealer and see what's what.
The diagrams in the Chilton's subaru manual I have are direct copies of the FSM. which is why I ask....maybe I'll just grab a FSM when the time comes though.
And yea, I'll keep you updated on the project. it's not uncommon, there are even options for motor mount adapters and such. But it's hard to get info on GM motors on Yota boards.....
#6
02-20-2010, 12:43 AM
OK... now we have something to work with....
the vin will tell you wether it's old (z) respectable (w) or the good one (x).
if it looks like my sig pic (minus faggy grille) where it has a seperate headlight/marker light, then it is a 98+ (w)
if it looks like my sig pic but has one big ugly headlight on each end with color crap on the sides it's a 95-97 (mostly w's)
if it's more square looking than my sig pic it's a first gen S-series blazer (z's for the most part but odd w's from 92-94)
OR if you get a chance to get hands on the truck, look at the sticker on the driver's door
, it will tell you.
the vin will tell you wether it's old (z) respectable (w) or the good one (x).
if it looks like my sig pic (minus faggy grille) where it has a seperate headlight/marker light, then it is a 98+ (w)
if it looks like my sig pic but has one big ugly headlight on each end with color crap on the sides it's a 95-97 (mostly w's)
if it's more square looking than my sig pic it's a first gen S-series blazer (z's for the most part but odd w's from 92-94)
OR if you get a chance to get hands on the truck, look at the sticker on the driver's door
, it will tell you.
Last edited by ABN31B; 02-20-2010 at 12:50 AM.
#7
02-20-2010, 05:34 AM
it's actually the 8th digit Curtis.
you keep mentioning, "the block that's in better shape", what's the issue with the engines?
does one blow smoke? run bad? not look so purdy?
??????OK... now we have something to work with....
the vin will tell you wether it's old (z) respectable (w) or the good one (x).
if it looks like my sig pic (minus faggy grille) where it has a seperate headlight/marker light, then it is a 98+ (w)
if it looks like my sig pic but has one big ugly headlight on each end with color crap on the sides it's a 95-97 (mostly w's)
if it's more square looking than my sig pic it's a first gen S-series blazer (z's for the most part but odd w's from 92-94)
OR if you get a chance to get hands on the truck, look at the sticker on the driver's door, it will tell you.
the vin will tell you wether it's old (z) respectable (w) or the good one (x).
if it looks like my sig pic (minus faggy grille) where it has a seperate headlight/marker light, then it is a 98+ (w)
if it looks like my sig pic but has one big ugly headlight on each end with color crap on the sides it's a 95-97 (mostly w's)
if it's more square looking than my sig pic it's a first gen S-series blazer (z's for the most part but odd w's from 92-94)
OR if you get a chance to get hands on the truck, look at the sticker on the driver's door
, it will tell you.don't be dissin' the Z code Curtis, that's what was in my '92-and it could haul!
as for the sticker, that's a gamble, most of the trucks either get them painted over (i hope your buddy didn't have to paint the doors when he switched them to his other truck, Numbchux), or it's simply faded away (it was a '93 right?)
give us a little more insight to what your (perceived) issue is between the two engines, it'll help with us giving you better detailed info.
#8
02-20-2010, 03:20 PM
yea, the blazer is definitely a '93. so it's either a Z or a W. He says the injection system is different than that in the pickup....which makes me suspect W.
pickup is the same body style. not sure on the year. which means it pretty much has to be a Z.
as for the condition thing. the blazer one has been sitting for about 8 months, he says it leaks oil, etc. Still a solid runner, but the one in his pickup was in use until just last week, has fewer miles on it (only about 15k difference though....), and doesn't leak at all. I would trust the blazer engine, but if it was as easy as swapping the intake, I'd rather use the pickup engine. if I have to pull heads, I'll just do a reseal on the blazer engine and call it a day.
pickup is the same body style. not sure on the year. which means it pretty much has to be a Z.
as for the condition thing. the blazer one has been sitting for about 8 months, he says it leaks oil, etc. Still a solid runner, but the one in his pickup was in use until just last week, has fewer miles on it (only about 15k difference though....), and doesn't leak at all. I would trust the blazer engine, but if it was as easy as swapping the intake, I'd rather use the pickup engine. if I have to pull heads, I'll just do a reseal on the blazer engine and call it a day.
#9
03-19-2010, 06:26 PM
just a little update. snow is melting so project/parts cars are becoming accessible for us MN car guys! He got out to it, and got the vin today. it is a "W" engine in the blazer, so that's awesome. I'll see if I can make it to a dealer to identify the transmission tomorrow, otherwise it might have to wait until monday.
I really hope it's a 4L60E
I really hope it's a 4L60E
#10
03-19-2010, 07:07 PM
If he's sure its a 4 speed auto then it has to be one of those. On a local 4x site a few people have done the 4.3 swap into yota's. My buddy was planning to do the same thing in his pickup. He is still gathering the parts he wants. From the blazer he is using the wiring, ecm, motor, fuel tank and pump.