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97 Rocker Valve Adjustment

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  #21  
Old 06-02-2017, 08:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Tynan Tha Real Dill
ok I'm about to loosen the rockers on those 2 cylinders now. Also sealed my fuel pressure gauge, ran another test and it took the pressure quite awhile to drop to 0. Hopefully its the overtightened rockers, because getting an air compressor is going to be really tough to come across. I really appreciate the help !!
Great! It's never a problem to help a young person who wants to learn how to fix his own vehicle and does not give up easily! You are the exception, so kudos to you! Please let us know the results of the compression test with the rocker nuts loosened.

I'm just curious..... from your old posts in various threads it seems you bought your Blazer earlier this year and replaced intake gaskets because of coolant in the oil. Then trouble with batteries while cranking to try to work on engine. Then trouble with distributor and engine knocking and you posted a pic of distributor with milky oil all over. Then some talk of replacing engine for a while. Then more recently the talk of overtightened valves, a no-start, and discovery of 2 dead cylinders. Was your vehicle bought as an unknown non-running project? Looks like a nice one in the photo you posted in your Garage. Have you ever had it running on all 6 cylinders or has it always just barely run (at best)? Can you tie all of this together for me? Just trying to understand the big picture here.

If you end up needing an air compressor and can't borrow one - I suppose there are tool rental companies that have them for rent.

p.s. this is the reason to keep your posts in same thread so readers can understand problems from the beginning, the diagnosis, and the repair sequences that were undertaken.
 

Last edited by LesMyer; 06-02-2017 at 08:58 AM.
  #22  
Old 06-02-2017, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Lesmyer
Great! It's never a problem to help a young person who wants to learn how to fix his own vehicle and does not give up easily! You are the exception, so kudos to you! Please let us know the results of the compression test with the rocker nuts loosened.

I'm just curious..... from your old posts in various threads it seems you bought your Blazer earlier this year and replaced intake gaskets because of coolant in the oil. Then trouble with batteries while cranking to try to work on engine. Then trouble with distributor and engine knocking and you posted a pic of distributor with milky oil all over. Then some talk of replacing engine for a while. Then more recently the talk of overtightened valves, a no-start, and discovery of 2 dead cylinders. Was your vehicle bought as an unknown non-running project? Looks like a nice one in the photo you posted in your Garage. Have you ever had it running on all 6 cylinders or has it always just barely run (at best)? Can you tie all of this together for me? Just trying to understand the big picture here.

If you end up needing an air compressor and can't borrow one - I suppose there are tool rental companies that have them for rent.

p.s. this is the reason to keep your posts in same thread so readers can understand problems from the beginning, the diagnosis, and the repair sequences that were undertaken.
Yea I'm really anxious to drive it, its my first SUV. First day I bought it (March 6), it started up and I reversed it and pulled it up the tow truck, seller told me it was a blown head gasket and it was leaking coolant around the drivers side bottom intake and valve cover. They also said it ran fine then died all of a sudden. They never started it up again and sit for 2 weeks before I bought it. When I made it home, I drove it to my apartment checked the oil etc. Drove it outside the complex to do an oil change ( put 6 QTS of oil in 😱 ) along with Bars Leak Blown Head Gasket Fix to try to seal the head gasket...hasnt started since. Took it to a buddy's and pulled the intake. Found the valve cover gasket wasn't on right and the drivers side intake was really loose ( I twisted the bolts loose with my fingers ), allowing coolant to leak and with the gap between the valve cover and the head on drivers side, coolant was draining into the head, sealed it up, with new intake gaskets, and screwed my distributor up by not aligning the shaft with the oil pump shaft and I started it up. It had a really loud bang when it ran this time. So I shut it off, went to set TDC using a screwdriver in plug hole and pinched the screwdriver tip and broke it in the head, seizing my motor. Took to grandpas to pull head to get the screwdriver tip, then decided to change that gasket while I had the head off. Put it all back together, tightened the valves to 40 lbs, and hasnt started since...and this where i started posting for help. But Im going to try to do whatever I can to get it running before I quit on it !

OK, I loosened the rocker nuts and did the compression test on those cylinders. Did it on cylinder # 2 and read 120 psi. Did the same on #5 and it read 115 psi. Went to torque them down, starting with #5, and tested five again, and it stayed at zero again. Pics are the readings...Also discovered my passenger side upper intake gasket is blown/broke, also in pic. Could that be a problem too ?

P.s. I didnt mean to post a new thread, I thought I was replying lol
 
Attached Thumbnails 97 Rocker Valve Adjustment-img_20170602_122758.jpg   97 Rocker Valve Adjustment-img_20170602_124303.jpg   97 Rocker Valve Adjustment-img_20170602_113623.jpg  

Last edited by Tynan Tha Real Dill; 06-02-2017 at 02:27 PM.
  #23  
Old 06-02-2017, 03:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Tynan Tha Real Dill
Yea I'm really anxious to drive it, its my first SUV. First day I bought it (March 6), it started up and I reversed it and pulled it up the tow truck, seller told me it was a blown head gasket and it was leaking coolant around the drivers side bottom intake and valve cover. They also said it ran fine then died all of a sudden. They never started it up again and sit for 2 weeks before I bought it. When I made it home, I drove it to my apartment checked the oil etc. Drove it outside the complex to do an oil change ( put 6 QTS of oil in �� ) along with Bars Leak Blown Head Gasket Fix to try to seal the head gasket...hasnt started since. Took it to a buddy's and pulled the intake. Found the valve cover gasket wasn't on right and the drivers side intake was really loose ( I twisted the bolts loose with my fingers ), allowing coolant to leak and with the gap between the valve cover and the head on drivers side, coolant was draining into the head, sealed it up, with new intake gaskets, and screwed my distributor up by not aligning the shaft with the oil pump shaft and I started it up. It had a really loud bang when it ran this time. So I shut it off, went to set TDC using a screwdriver in plug hole and pinched the screwdriver tip and broke it in the head, seizing my motor. Took to grandpas to pull head to get the screwdriver tip, then decided to change that gasket while I had the head off. Put it all back together, tightened the valves to 40 lbs, and hasnt started since...and this where i started posting for help. But Im going to try to do whatever I can to get it running before I quit on it !

OK, I loosened the rocker nuts and did the compression test on those cylinders. Did it on cylinder # 2 and read 120 psi. Did the same on #5 and it read 115 psi. Went to torque them down, starting with #5, and tested five again, and it stayed at zero again. Pics are the readings...Also discovered my passenger side upper intake gasket is blown/broke, also in pic. Could that be a problem too ?

P.s. I didnt mean to post a new thread, I thought I was replying lol
Now we are getting somewhere!!! I would source 4 rocker studs and stop nuts for those on cylinders #2 and #5 (these are quite specific for vin W 4.3 engines in late 1990's /early 2000's - so don't try to substitute anything generic), install them, torque them, and recheck compression to make sure you still have it. You may later want to replace all 16, but I think right now we just want to get it running for minimal cost. The orange gasket is damaged from installing the plastic part of the intake. You will definitely need a new gasket, so might as well buy the upper intake set. Coat with Vaseline and take care when installing the plastic past of the intake. There may be other things to fix before it runs, but that is all for now. Install and report. Any questions about installation please ask.

Was there any observable marks in the piston from the screwdriver tip? If so please describe.

You had mentioned a new distributor at one time - did you get oil pressure after install, or hasn't it run since install?
 

Last edited by LesMyer; 06-02-2017 at 04:08 PM.
  #24  
Old 06-02-2017, 04:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Lesmyer
As for valve adjustment on a 1997 Blazer - once you are sure valve train is OK...
What do you mean by "valve train is OK" ?Does that mean to make sure the valves are open when I torque them down ? And is this the intake/valve diagram for my engine ? Says its for GM 4.3 Vortec, but doesn't say the year (See pic)...if not can you draw it out for me ? Also, how do you tell if a valve is open ? Is it when the rods are all the way up or all the way down ?...when I tightened these, I didnt do anything but torque them. I didnt know if I was to look for the valves to open or not, and I'm still curious...I'm sorry, took me almost a month to fully understand the timing process lol
 
Attached Thumbnails 97 Rocker Valve Adjustment-2012-01-04_230217_pic.gif  

Last edited by Tynan Tha Real Dill; 06-02-2017 at 04:23 PM.
  #25  
Old 06-02-2017, 05:13 PM
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"Was there any observable marks in the piston from the screwdriver tip? If so please describe.

You had mentioned a new distributor at one time - did you get oil pressure after install, or hasn't it run since install?"

Oil sensor broke, replaced it and has oil pressure now. The pic is cylinder #1 where the tip was jammed. In the other pic, are #3 and #5 open or closed in the position there in ? And do I need to tighten the rocker nuts in open or closed position ?
 
Attached Thumbnails 97 Rocker Valve Adjustment-fb_img_1496438950096.jpg   97 Rocker Valve Adjustment-fb_img_1496439197351.jpg   97 Rocker Valve Adjustment-fb_img_1496439302390.jpg  

Last edited by Tynan Tha Real Dill; 06-02-2017 at 05:16 PM.
  #26  
Old 06-02-2017, 08:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Tynan Tha Real Dill
What do you mean by "valve train is OK" ?Does that mean to make sure the valves are open when I torque them down ? And is this the intake/valve diagram for my engine ? Says its for GM 4.3 Vortec, but doesn't say the year (See pic)...if not can you draw it out for me ? Also, how do you tell if a valve is open ? Is it when the rods are all the way up or all the way down ?...when I tightened these, I didnt do anything but torque them. I didnt know if I was to look for the valves to open or not, and I'm still curious...I'm sorry, took me almost a month to fully understand the timing process lol
Right now you have verified that the valve train for cylinders #2 and #5 needs repair. So fix that so you can torque down the stop nuts and still have compression. This is what I mean by the valve train being OK. Don't need to worry about having the engine or valve in any particular position when you do it. Just torque to 20 ft lbs.

But FYI, a valve is open when the push rod is all the way up.
 
  #27  
Old 06-02-2017, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Tynan Tha Real Dill
"Was there any observable marks in the piston from the screwdriver tip? If so please describe.

You had mentioned a new distributor at one time - did you get oil pressure after install, or hasn't it run since install?"

Oil sensor broke, replaced it and has oil pressure now. The pic is cylinder #1 where the tip was jammed. In the other pic, are #3 and #5 open or closed in the position there in ? And do I need to tighten the rocker nuts in open or closed position ?
Ouch, looks like the piston got pretty beat up with the screwdriver tip. Definitely not good, but shouldn't keep from starting. Guess it should be a try it and see if it lasts type thing. Maybe the piston gods will shine on you and you will get away with it!

Can't see any valve train for #3 or #5 in 2nd photo to say anything about. Only thing there would be the lifters and I can't see them.

Again, rocker nuts can be torqued with valve in any position. It doesn't matter.
 

Last edited by LesMyer; 06-02-2017 at 08:17 PM.
  #28  
Old 06-03-2017, 08:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Lesmyer
Ouch, looks like the piston got pretty beat up with the screwdriver tip. Definitely not good, but shouldn't keep from starting. Guess it should be a try it and see if it lasts type thing. Maybe the piston gods will shine on you and you will get away with it!

Can't see any valve train for #3 or #5 in 2nd photo to say anything about. Only thing there would be the lifters and I can't see them.

Again, rocker nuts can be torqued with valve in any position. It doesn't matter.
ok I have it packed down with the rocker arm torque and position, tighten them the but til it stops then torque it to 20 lbs, thank u for clearing that up. Yea my grandpa told me the piston wasn't that bad and I got lucky. So my next job is to pull the studs and replace them, luckily I grabbed extra when I broke one and had to replace it. I tightened it til it broke.

OK, I didn't recieve your last messages before I did this. But I followed this tightening procedure :

"4.3L Vortec Valve Adjustment

To prepare the engine for valve adjustment, rotate the crankshaft until the mark on the damper pulley aligns with the 0° mark on the timing plate and the No. 1 cylinder is on the compression stroke. You will know when the No. 1 piston is on it's compression stroke because both the intake and exhaust valves will remain closed as the crankshaft damper mark approaches the timing scale.

With the engine on the compression stroke, adjust the exhaust valves of cylinders No. 1, 5 and 6 and the intake valves of cylinders No. 1, 2 and 3 by performing the following procedures:

Back out the adjusting nut until lash can be felt at the pushrod.

While rotating the pushrod, turn the adjusting nut inward until all of the lash is removed.

When the play has disappeared, turn the adjusting nut inward 1 additional turn for 1988-93 engines or 13/4 additional turns for 1994 engines.

Rotate the crankshaft 1 complete revolution and align the mark on the damper pulley with the 0° mark on the timing plate; the engine is now positioned on the No. 4 firing position. This time the No. 4 cylinder valves remain closed as the timing mark approaches the scale. Adjust the exhaust valves of cylinders No. 2, 3 and 4 and the intake valves of cylinders No. 4, 5 and 6, by performing the following procedures:

Back out the adjusting nut until lash can be felt at the pushrod.

While rotating the pushrod, turn the adjusting nut inward until all of the lash is removed.

When the play has disappeared, turn the adjusting nut inward 1 additional turn for 1988-93 engines or 13/4 additional turns for 1994 engines."
Now after I did this, I have no compression in any cylinders, even with the nuts backed off. Though, I think my compression gauge isn't working, the pressure release button is stuck pushed in. So I'm either going to unstick it or exchange it for another. On hold until then, but I'll remove/replace those 4 studs until then.
 
  #29  
Old 06-05-2017, 10:24 PM
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[QUOTE=Lesmyer;677136]So please do the tests I described in post #17 (backing off the rocker nuts a couple of turns on those two cylinders) and report./QUOTE]
Ok I fixed my compression gauge, the air release button was stuck. Backed off the nuts on them and ran another compression test. Had compression 120+ in all but 1 cylinder, it had 60 psi. But my battery was dying by the time I was getting to that cylinder. So I'm charging my battery and jump starter tonight to insure it doesn't die during testing in the morning. Due to those cylinders not getting compression while torqued down, I still need to replace the studs, correct ?

PS ... As long as I have at least 100+ PSI in every cylinder and there is none less than 75% of the highest cylinder, she should fire up and run, right ?
 
  #30  
Old 06-06-2017, 07:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Lesmyer
So please do the tests I described in post #17 (backing off the rocker nuts a couple of turns on those two cylinders) and report./QUOTE]
Ok I fixed my compression gauge, the air release button was stuck. Backed off the nuts on them and ran another compression test. Had compression 120+ in all but 1 cylinder, it had 60 psi. But my battery was dying by the time I was getting to that cylinder. So I'm charging my battery and jump starter tonight to insure it doesn't die during testing in the morning. Due to those cylinders not getting compression while torqued down, I still need to replace the studs, correct ?

PS ... As long as I have at least 100+ PSI in every cylinder and there is none less than 75% of the highest cylinder, she should fire up and run, right ?
If you have no compression on #2 and #5 with rockers torqued to 20 psi, but compression returns when you loosen the rocker nuts - then the stop surface on the studs and nuts are damaged and they need replaced. The nuts are turning down past where they should stop when torqueing and this is holding a valve open. Make sure you replace the rocker nuts too

You shouldn't notice any miss on a cylinder if compression is above around 60 psi. I once had an old V8 that was so worn out that it had 60-80 psi on all cylinders. It ran fine with no misses and didn't even use much oil, but was very difficult to start in cold weather and had little power. Came from beating it up and down those white rock gravel roads they have in Iowa with no air cleaner or muffler for a year or so. Thought I had a hot rod!! This car ultimately ended up being my first successful engine rebuild. I won't even comment on my first try when I was 14 - that was already a lost cause when I started.

Good luck. Don't forget there can be other things preventing from starting, but without compression on all cylinders there is no reason to even try to start it. If it doesn't start after these repairs, let us know and we can go through checking the distributor and it's installation. The rest you pretty much have already covered.

Keep in mind that it will be very hard to start after squirting oil in the cylinders (requiring extrended cranking), and then it will smoke like crazy and run poorly for a little when it does start. Probably you will want to crank it over for maybe 30 seconds with all the spark plugs out to get as much oil out as possible before putting them back in.
 

Last edited by LesMyer; 06-06-2017 at 12:46 PM.


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