I can tell you one thing. I put in the AC Delco AFS105 sensors last night and logged a run. Then I compared it with a log from when I put in the 'new' Borg Warner O2s. HOLY FREAKIN' HECK Batman! What a difference in the response of the sensor. Night and day. The AC Delco actually has points between the peaks and valleys on the graph while the Borg Warner just hits the highs and lows. That is a great thing for the PCM to see.

Now, The B1S1 (driver's side upstream) was heat discolored (kind of a coppery color) up on the nut and was soot covered at the sensor tip. And B2S1 (passenger side upstream) was just like the day that I put it in... I didn't get a chance to take a look at the plugs, but it idles nice and smooth now where before it would idle really rough. Could the sensor malfunctioning cause bank 1 to run rich/hot (they don't seem to go together in my mind... normally rich = cooler, lean = hotter)... Or could the heater of just malfunctioned in the sensor and basically fried itself? I got a P0131 - B1S1 low voltage and P0134 - B1S1 Insufficient Activity... The low voltage means the sensor was running abnormally lean, and dumping fuel in like there's no tomorrow to try to compensate. I'll have to log some more runs later on this week to get a full picture of if I have a problem somewhere else in the system...

 

Have you checked out your temp sensor yet?

 

dont forget.... you could have a problem higher up than the O2 sensors, and this is causing the O2 sensor to crap out... you are probably running too rich, due to something else...


look into that first before you spend more on the O2 sensors..

good luck

 

Ok... Well damn it... I just had a nice long post and now it's gone... Somehow I got logged off and it disappeared.

Anyway, I am not ruling out a problem higher up, but the fact that I didn't have a problem before... I replaced the sensors as preventative maintenance. I scanned the computer and through some simple tests, found that both B1S1 and B2S1 were lazy. These 2 sensors combine with other sensors that tell the computer how much fuel to inject.

I have inspected the fuel system, running through all of the checks as stated on AllDataDIY.com, including leak down tests from full pressure (60-66psi) and 10psi. Both checked out perfectly fine. I also strapped my pressure gauge to the hood and test drove it with it on there. Everything was well within specs there as well. If I had a fuel system problem, it would not have passed all of those tests. With the old O2 sensors, the LTFT were out of whack on B1. With the new sensors, they are both holding steady right with each other. Also, the average injector pulse widths (ms) were reading high on B1 to try to compensate for the abnormally lean condition that the sensor was reading, while the B2 IPW was fine. Once I replaced the sensors, both IPWs were almost identical (within afew tenths of a millisecond).

I would think that if it was something like a temp sensor (or any other sensor that effects fuel delivery) that it would effect both sides of the engine the same. The B2S1 sensor that I pulled last night was working ok, still not as active as the Delco's, but it was working.

Ok... I'm going to post this now before it disappears again... I'll add anything else later

 

Oh... Another thing. Are there separate temp sensors for the gauge and what the computer needs to see or are they one in the same? My gauge has been spot on and always checks out with what is displayed on my computer when I tap in.

*EDIT - I do have 2 temp sensors. One for the gauge and one for the PCM. I haven't check that recently... Probably haven't in about a month. I'll check it tonight as well as whip out my infrared thermometer and grab a rough estimate of temperature from the t-stat area.

 

There are usually two separate temp sensors. On for the gauge on the thermostat and one for the ecm on the head.( mine is left bank).
Now my ? is this "My 1st gen only haas one o2 just before the cat- would it be possible, efficient, and worth my effort to weld close that bunge and put noe just past the exhaust manifold on each side. Most V8's have one in that location but just on one side. Would the comp read accuratly with the two in place and wired together. (Is that all making sense.)
Delete the original location and move to each end of the Y-pipe with joined wiring. If I do this I will likely use the heated ones as well.
I know that most 2nd gens use three but they are not all tied in together. I just want two but are tied together.
OR would I be better off just slapping a heated unit in the original location and just leave it at that.

All this is because I will be changing mine in the very near future (about that time again) and I just want to set it up as best as possible all in one clean swipe.




oh and I"M NOT TRYNG TO STEAL YOUR THREAD OR ANYTHING IT IS JUST THAT YOU APPEAR TO BE PRETTY GOOD WITH THE ELECTRICALS SO I THOUGHT I WOULD ASK.

 

swartllk,
You have some pretty cool tools.

 

I scanned everything again today and logged a run.

ECT was spot on 189-199 *F which is in the right frame for a 195*F stat.

So far everything points towards a crapped out sensor.
If anyone wants to see what data I pulled, and knows how to decypher it, have at it.
11.23.05_brav.02.xls

I transferred the data into Excel. I can also replay the data on my laptop so I really just drive when logging and review it after the fact.

I can get a LOT of different data. I have the GM Enhanced data as well. For a complete listing of what I can do, go to Autotap.com (GM Enhanced Data listing).

 

chevylane2003, I wouldn't go moving it. Due to the fact that you aren't really sequential injection, it uses a batch fire method and the banks are not independant. That is the reason why there is only one. You really wouldn't benefit from having 2 O2 sensors with the current injection and control system.

 

Didn't really figure it would be useful. Was just asking so I can prep for the work. I guess that I will just get a heated one and leave it at that. thanks